Secret Ingredients & Natural Products for Hair

[westNDNbeauty]

I came a cross a few online sellers who are creating their own natural hair products. But when you read the list of ingredients, they may list a few and say the rest are "Secret Ingredients".

What are your thoughts on this subject? Would you purchase?

 

[loolalooh]

"Secret ingredients" should be listed, IMO. What if a customer is allergic to the substance? I wouldn't buy a product not listing all its ingredients.

 

[Curlykale]

No. I can understand the will to protect some new products from the aggressive market but I have had to experiment so much with my hair in order to get it healthy that I simply can't afford to use random ingredients... So I never try them, no matter if 500 people are saying it's great. I prefer to be in control when it comes to my hair...

 

[Lola Laughs]

I came a cross a few online sellers who are creating their own natural hair products. But when you read the list of ingredients, they may list a few and say the rest are "Secret Ingredients".

What are your thoughts on this subject? Would you purchase?

Nope. Most folks who are interested in natural products are very particular about the ingredients. That's an odd marketing choice.

BTW, lovvv you hair in the siggy!

 

[westNDNbeauty]

Nope. Most folks who are interested in natural products are very particular about the ingredients. That's an odd marketing choice.

BTW, lovvv you hair in the siggy!

Same thing I thought.

I honestly don't understand why they can't list the ingredients. We all know, unless a person knows the formula, there is little risk in someone duplicating your product successfully.

 

[justicefighter1913]

ITA! I need to know what's in the product. Although, when a product says something like, "Herbal Oil Complex", I'll still use the product if they list everything else. AfroVeda, for example, labels their products like this, and I'm still comfortable with using them.

 

[LittleLuxe]

Well I try to understand it from their POV. For instance these women took the time to discover a formula and set of ingredients that work for the health of the hair in one way or another. They sell this product which is helpful to others and in doing so manage to make a profit. Some of these women even see such a rise in profits that they are able to take their companies slightly mainstream. This is GREAT for them.

Now keep in mind they are more at risk than your average Pantene or Loreal. Pantene and Loreal has chemists actively working to create concoctions that will likely never be imitatible by your average girl at home. These concoctions are for the most part incredibly effective and they bring in a profit. However these women creating all-natural products are using ingredients which can be easily purchased from any store. Since the ingredients list is so short and the ingredients are both all-natural and easilly-purchasable. They are at FAR more risk of having their product copied and used without them seeing any profit.

And furthermore unless you are inclined what would then encourage you to purchase that product? I recall when BT came out it was very effective, people loved it and were raving about it. Everyone wanted it and then someone posted the recipe for it. Then everyone was making their own BT - that assuredly means the creator of that product lost a profit from that.

So yes. It's not pleasant to not see everything on the list but a lot of these women are trying to protect an income.

 

[newbeginnings2010]

Well I try to understand it from their POV. For instance these women took the time to discover a formula and set of ingredients that work for the health of the hair in one way or another. They sell this product which is helpful to others and in doing so manage to make a profit. Some of these women even see such a rise in profits that they are able to take their companies slightly mainstream. This is GREAT for them.

Now keep in mind they are more at risk than your average Pantene or Loreal. Pantene and Loreal has chemists actively working to create concoctions that will likely never be imitatible by your average girl at home. These concoctions are for the most part incredibly effective and they bring in a profit. However these women creating all-natural products are using ingredients which can be easily purchased from any store.Since the ingredients list is so short and the ingredients are both all-natural and easilly-purchasable. They are at FAR more risk of having their product copied and used without them seeing any profit.

And furthermore unless you are inclined what would then encourage you to purchase that product? I recall when BT came out it was very effective, people loved it and were raving about it. Everyone wanted it and then someone posted the recipe for it. Then everyone was making their own BT - that assuredly means the creator of that product lost a profit from that.

So yes. It's not pleasant to not see everything on the list but a lot of these women are trying to protect an income.

Don't a lot of people make their own products already? Those who don't make their own or are too lazy (like me!) will buy the product either way because it's easier. They also wouldn't have to worry about anyone stealing and selling their product if they get a patent or it's patent pending, right? Not sure if this is true. I don't think they would lose that much business because those who are going to make their own products are going to do it anyways. Also, I think that the only way to save money making these products is to buy in bulk. Buying smaller amounts would be more expensive and you might end up spending the same amount as if you just bought it from the seller in the first place (in some cases, depending on the seller and how much they charge).

And to the OP, I wouldn't buy. I don't know a lot about natural hair care, but how do I know that what they claim is true? What's their definition of, "natural?" I'm a consumer, not a producer, and if I like a product I would buy it even if I did know all of the ingredients and could make it myself.

 

[LittleLuxe]

Don't a lot of people make their own products already? Those who don't make their own or are too lazy (like me!) will buy the product either way because it's easier. They also wouldn't have to worry about anyone stealing and selling their product if they get a patent or it's patent pending, right? Not sure if this is true. I don't think they would lose that much business because those who are going to make their own products are going to do it anyways. Also, I think that the only way to save money making these products is to buy in bulk. Buying smaller amounts would be more expensive and you might end up spending the same amount as if you just bought it from the seller in the first place (in some cases, depending on the seller and how much they charge).

And to the OP, I wouldn't buy. I don't know a lot about natural hair care, but how do I know that what they claim is true? What's their definition of, "natural?" I'm a consumer, not a producer, and if I like a product I would buy it even if I did know all of the ingredients and could make it myself.

I don't know how many people make their own products vs. buying but I do think more women are making them as they see how easy it is to get the ingredients. I mean these days we have sites like lotioncrafters selling all the technical stuff and other sites selling the essential oils so when your product has only 5 ingredients folks are less likely to purchase it + shipping and just make their own AND add extra stuff to it. Lol. I've come across SO many recipes for BT. Luckilly for the creator I have no interest in messing with sulfur so I purchase from her but I who never used to make anything is buying a lot of ingredients lately to mix stuff up and have ditched other essential oil growth aids since I can mix my own. It's fun, it makes you feel accomplished and it's not too hard.

Oh and I fully agree from a consumer POV you WANT to know, lol, but from a producer side you want to hide and try to keep making money.

 

[Neith]

It's not easy to make some products.

Try and make conditioner from scratch for instance. Takes a little more effort than throwing some oils around. lol. It's a complex set of steps that you won't be able to do without some major research.

 

[jamaica68]

No, I wouldn't purchase. I often wonder if they say "secret ingredients" because they have duplicated someone else's product(s) hmmmmmm, I'm just saying.

 

[temfash]

No, I wouldn't purchase. I often wonder if they say "secret ingredients" because they have duplicated someone else's product(s) hmmmmmm, I'm just saying.

I agree, it swings both ways.

 

[Pompous Blue]

Don't a lot of people make their own products already? Those who don't make their own or are too lazy (like me!) will buy the product either way because it's easier. They also wouldn't have to worry about anyone stealing and selling their product if they get a patent or it's patent pending, right? Not sure if this is true. I don't think they would lose that much business because those who are going to make their own products are going to do it anyways. Also, I think that the only way to save money making these products is to buy in bulk. Buying smaller amounts would be more expensive and you might end up spending the same amount as if you just bought it from the seller in the first place (in some cases, depending on the seller and how much they charge).

And to the OP, I wouldn't buy. I don't know a lot about natural hair care, but how do I know that what they claim is true? What's their definition of, "natural?" I'm a consumer, not a producer, and if I like a product I would buy it even if I did know all of the ingredients and could make it myself.

Very well stated and no I wouldn't purchase anything labeled "secret ingredient". I won't chance my health for some so-called miracle formula I don't know what's in it. Whether the owner is trying to protect their product or not is no concern to me. There are consumer laws to prevent secret ingredients being sold to an unsuspecting public; they should be careful a complaint isn't filed.

 

[LittleLuxe]

Well for those ladies who are concerned I would advise you study the labels of any product you purchase that is all-natural. A lot of ingredients are hidden under terms such as essential oil blend.

Also just as a tip a lot of ingredients are also hidden under the term fragrance. This is legally allowed and can range anywhere from 1 ingredient to 4 or 5.

Just for those ladies who are concerned and want to know all the ingredients.

 

[Pompous Blue]

Well for those ladies who are concerned I would advise you study the labels of any product you purchase that is all-natural. A lot of ingredients are hidden under terms such as essential oil blend.

Also just as a tip a lot of ingredients are also hidden under the term fragrance. This is legally allowed and can range anywhere from 1 ingredient to 4 or 5.

Just for those ladies who are concerned and want to know all the ingredients.

I do know about "essential Oils' and "fragrance" are hidden ingredients and falling under the umbrella of the unknown. But if that is what the "secret ingredient" is, then why not label it that?

 

[LittleLuxe]

I imagine for the same reason KFC doesn't have to reveal it's essential blend of herbs and spices and that Coke's ingredients are a internal secret.

Let's face it. It's a cut-throat world out there and with more kitchen-companies being created (where things are mixed up in the home) it's all about separating yourself from the competition. If you create a product that is a conditioner and you list all your ingredients then you'd hate for your competition to mimic all your ingredients by coming out with a new formula that is essentially your's with 2 or 3 other ingredients added.

I looked it up (I was curious) and it says: "COSMETIC INGREDIENT LABELING
DECLARATION OF INGREDIENTS EXCEPT FLAVOR, FRAGRANCE AND TRADE SECRET INGREDIENTS IN DESCENDING ORDER OF PREDOMINANCE. "

"DECLARATION OF TRADE SECRET INGREDIENTS
BY THE PHRASE ...
"AND OTHER INGREDIENTS"
IF ACCEPTED BY FDA AS EXEMPT FROM PUBLIC DISCLOSURE PURSUANT TO THE PROCEDURE OF § 720.8. "

"WHAT IS A TRADE SECRET?
A TRADE SECRET MAY CONSIST OF ANY FORMULA, PATTERN, DEVICE OR COMPILATION OF INFORMATION WHICH IS USED IN ONE'S BUSINESS AND WHICH GIVES HIM AN OPPORTUNITY TO OBTAIN AN ADVANTAGE OVER COMPETITORS WHO DO NOT KNOW OR USE IT."
(KFC and Coke, lol)

And if need be you can write to the FDA to request you not have to list all ingredients under the Trade Secret exemption.

"The first step in processing a request for trade secrecy, i.e., a request for exemption from label declaration, of the identity of a cosmetic ingredient is the submission to FDA of the following information:
(a) A semi-quantitative cosmetic formulation statement of the product in question on forms FD-2512 and 2512a.
(b) A full statement of the factual and legal grounds for the request, including all data and other information on which the petitioner relies (as well as any information known to the petitioner that is unfavorable to petitioner's position).
The statement of factual grounds should include scientific or technical data, reports, tests, and other relevant information that address the factors FDA considers in determining whether the identity of an ingredient qualifies as a trade secret. (The factors FDA considers are stated elsewhere.)
(c) A statement that the identity of the ingredient in question has not previously been disclosed to anyone without appropriate safeguards for secrecy as further explained in § 20.81."

 

[dyh080]

Just a legal note...some of these people are mixing up products at home in unlicensed kitchens and bathrooms.
So, for me, no....I would not purchase products that don't label all of the ingredients... and no homemade ones either ...who knows what else they are omitting?

 

[loolalooh]

I imagine for the same reason KFC doesn't have to reveal it's essential blend of herbs and spices and that Coke's ingredients are a internal secret.

Let's face it. It's a cut-throat world out there and with more kitchen-companies being created (where things are mixed up in the home) it's all about separating yourself from the competition. If you create a product that is a conditioner and you list all your ingredients then you'd hate for your competition to mimic all your ingredients by coming out with a new formula that is essentially your's with 2 or 3 other ingredients added.

I looked it up (I was curious) and it says: "COSMETIC INGREDIENT LABELING
DECLARATION OF INGREDIENTS EXCEPT FLAVOR, FRAGRANCE AND TRADE SECRET INGREDIENTS IN DESCENDING ORDER OF PREDOMINANCE. "

"DECLARATION OF TRADE SECRET INGREDIENTS
BY THE PHRASE ...
"AND OTHER INGREDIENTS"
IF ACCEPTED BY FDA AS EXEMPT FROM PUBLIC DISCLOSURE PURSUANT TO THE PROCEDURE OF § 720.8. "

"WHAT IS A TRADE SECRET?
A TRADE SECRET MAY CONSIST OF ANY FORMULA, PATTERN, DEVICE OR COMPILATION OF INFORMATION WHICH IS USED IN ONE'S BUSINESS AND WHICH GIVES HIM AN OPPORTUNITY TO OBTAIN AN ADVANTAGE OVER COMPETITORS WHO DO NOT KNOW OR USE IT."
(KFC and Coke, lol)

And if need be you can write to the FDA to request you not have to list all ingredients under the Trade Secret exemption.

"The first step in processing a request for trade secrecy, i.e., a request for exemption from label declaration, of the identity of a cosmetic ingredient is the submission to FDA of the following information:
(a) A semi-quantitative cosmetic formulation statement of the product in question on forms FD-2512 and 2512a.
(b) A full statement of the factual and legal grounds for the request, including all data and other information on which the petitioner relies (as well as any information known to the petitioner that is unfavorable to petitioner's position).
The statement of factual grounds should include scientific or technical data, reports, tests, and other relevant information that address the factors FDA considers in determining whether the identity of an ingredient qualifies as a trade secret. (The factors FDA considers are stated elsewhere.)
(c) A statement that the identity of the ingredient in question has not previously been disclosed to anyone without appropriate safeguards for secrecy as further explained in § 20.81."

Sellers with "secret ingredients" need to be aware of the bolded. I wonder if many are not.

 

[NIN4eva]

LOL...pisht! It'll stay a secret... cause I won't be buying it.

 

[Tiye]

I came a cross a few online sellers who are creating their own natural hair products. But when you read the list of ingredients, they may list a few and say the rest are "Secret Ingredients".

What are your thoughts on this subject? Would you purchase?

Nope. I would not purchase coz this is not professional and it's talking down the the consumer. I'm an indie cosmetic maker and stuff like this gives us all a bad name. Recipes can be secret but ingredients should not be.

 

[KnottyGurl]

I understand why they may want to keep ingredients secret, but they still should disclose them. Even if there are only five ingredients, you would still have to figure out how much of each ingredient to use and how to combine them. Most people don't have that much time or patience to try it themselves anyway.

Reveal the "what" and hide the "how"

 

[sweetlaughter]

Just like I wouldn't buy food with "secret ingredient" listed, I wouldn't buy that for my hair as well. "Natural and artificial flavors" on foods creeps me out. Feels like they have something to hide.

 

[coolsista-paris]

i wouldnt buy it! thats mad. If your professionnal you normally MUST have every ingredient written down. what if someone is allergic to a " secret ingredient" in that bottle????

 

[DivaD04]

prime example...dr miracles...the hair destroyer...all dr. miracles products are secretive and yet sells crap for products

 

[westNDNbeauty]

bump........

 

[westNDNbeauty]

Just a legal note...some of these people are mixing up products at home in unlicensed kitchens and bathrooms.
So, for me, no....I would not purchase products that don't label all of the ingredients... and no homemade ones either ...who knows what else they are omitting?

I agree.

When one compares online home factories to what Coke & KFC does, although a good attempt at making a comparison, but please don't forget a home business does not generate the funds that are generated by Coke & KFC. So God forbid there were to be some sort of allergic reaction, Coke & KFC more than likely can withstand the resulting financial consequences. Can a home business withstand the same?

 

[LittleLuxe]

I agree.

When one compares online home factories to what Coke & KFC does, although a good attempt at making a comparison, but please don't forget a home business does not generate the funds that are generated by Coke & KFC. So God forbid there were to be some sort of allergic reaction, Coke & KFC more than likely can withstand the resulting financial consequences. Can a home business withstand the same?

When I made the comparison of KFC and Coke I was merely trying to name two very popular companies who are basically operating under the business practice of non-disclosure.

Now I think if someone is concerned they should only stick to products that they are able to know all the ingredients (it may be worth a shot to email an online seller to see if they will disclose) for the sake of their own health. I understand that is why many women turn to all-natural products so I fully support it.

However there are also laws pertaining to ingredients people would/could be allergic to. For instance the most popular one being nuts, a company/producer does not have to disclose what type of nut merely that it contains nuts thereby 'informing' the consumer.

Though now that you mention it I would be curious to know how that would work in regards to a technically listed ingredient and allergic reactions. For instance if your bottle states 'Essential Oil Blend' and someone has an allergic reaction to Rosemary or something, are you still responsible? Interesting. I'll keep researching.