The Protein vs. Moisture debate continues

[caress]

This has been talked about plenty of times but I still feel the need to ask a question so that I can get this straight. First, protein is for strength and moisture is for elasticity, right? Then if I'm experiencing breakage does that actually mean that my hair is need of more elasticity and therefore moisture? If my hair was too elastic (whatever that means or if that is even possible) I'd need more protein than moisture?

Many people say they're hair feels mushy when it needs protein but I've never experienced this, I don't think. Please help me to understand better. I may be using the wrong approach by using protein for my breakage. Please break it down so that it can forever and consistently be broke.

You'd think I'd have this mastered as many years as I have been doing the hair board/club/group thing. TIA!

 

[greAtness333]

Does your hair feel hard and looks dull? That could mean it's breaking from too much protein. If it's just dry and you're unable to stretch your hair without it breaking then you need moisture. HTH.

 

[sillygurl18]

@ Please break it down so that it can forever and consistently be broke.

 

[Tene]

bump

 

[Innocent_Kiss]

Nah, it's pretty simple to me.
Just do both moderately (well moisture MORE). Too much protein is not a good thing. It depends on your hair regimen and what products you use. You know best what your hair needs. I don't know

maybe someone can elaborate. I've actually never really been into the whole protein thing. A little is ok to me but I'd rather use other alternatives like natural herbs (Nuetral Henna, Lotus Powder) from Everyday Henna for strength.

 

[CheerBear]

Ok..both moisture and protein are needed for elasticity. Now both dry and weak hair are breakage prone, but I think the breakage may be different(people correct me if I'm wrong!) Ok,dry hair will just break all the time for no good reason..weak hair will be more likely to experience more breakage while being handled. Hair that needs moisture looks and feels rough..hair in need of protein may look healthy. If you use heat appliances alot and are experiencing breakage..you probably need protein. I think I had more to see..or had a clearer point, but im really sleepy right now. LOL I hope someone comes and makes sense of my mess here! HTH

 

[Tammy]

Ok, so let's throw some products out there. My moisture conditioner = ? Protein = ?

 

[Neroli]

Hair, especially relaxed hair, needs a little protein and lots of moisture. For my 4b relaxed hair, moisture moisture moisture and protein every now and then. If I had to choose, I would select moisture over protein. But since I'm blessed to have both, I do moisture at all times and do proteins on an as needed basis (once a month for hardcore or once every 2 weeks for softcore -- or not at all if my hair is rocking without it!) I think first and foremost you must listen to YOUR hair . . .

 

[keylargo]

[ QUOTE ]
Neroli said:
Hair, especially relaxed hair, needs a little protein and lots of moisture. For my 4b relaxed hair, moisture moisture moisture and protein every now and then. If I had to choose, I would select moisture over protein. But since I'm blessed to have both, I do moisture at all times and do proteins on an as needed basis (once a month for hardcore or once every 2 weeks for softcore -- or not at all if my hair is rocking without it!) I think first and foremost you must listen to YOUR hair . . .

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this method works better for me too. My hair is VERY sensitive to protein. I thought my hair was breaking so much because I needed more protein or the products that I was using for protein were not working. So, I would switch from product to product trying to stop breakage. I don't know what made it click in me to stop using the protein based products for a while. When I did, the breakage stopped right away. Now, I concentrate on moisturizers with no protein.

I tried using Motions Ultranourish Hair recently as a leave-in and immediately had breakage. Once I washed it out, the breakage stopped. It had to have been the protein.

Now, my hair finally feels good.

 

[caress]

[ QUOTE ]
sillygurl18 said:

@ Please break it down so that it can forever and consistently be broke.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is part of a line from the movie Love Jones. I wish I had thought of that on my own.

 

[caress]

[ QUOTE ]
greAtness333 said:
Does your hair feel hard and looks dull? That could mean it's breaking from too much protein. If it's just dry and you're unable to stretch your hair without it breaking then you need moisture. HTH.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well my ends don't really stretch but the rest does have some elasticity. My hair does not really feel hard. I do notice that when I go out in humid weather my hair feels softer (and drops while my ends frizz). My hair doesn't shine much on it's own but I know that type 4's hair has more sheen than shine. (Right?

) And it is dry though I assume that comes with the territory when you have curly/coily hair, when you relax your hair, or when you heat style your hair.

[ QUOTE ]
CheerBear said:
Ok,dry hair will just break all the time for no good reason..weak hair will be more likely to experience more breakage while being handled. Hair that needs moisture looks and feels rough..hair in need of protein may look healthy.

[/ QUOTE ]

My hair breaks when I handle it--that is, when I blowdry it and when I comb it without putting some type of lubricant on my ends.

[ QUOTE ]
Neroli said:
I think first and foremost you must listen to YOUR hair . . .

[/ QUOTE ]

That's just it. I still don't think I know what to look for. I guess I'll just eliminate protein for a while and see what happens.

 

[Chakira]

I think that was my problem too. Protein overload. I kept getting breakage, so I kept using different kinds of protein. I ended up this past weekend cutting off my damaged/breaking ends and used a moisturising conditioner, no protein, and it worked out well

 

[tane]

is motions cpr a protein or moisterizer

 

[Chakira]

I think CPR is a protein, but I could be wrong

 

[Cleo]

No you are right, CPR is protein.

 

[Neroli]

[ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]

That's just it. I still don't think I know what to look for. I guess I'll just eliminate protein for a while and see what happens.

[/ QUOTE ]

When in doubt, stop proteins and focus on moisture. IMO, maintaining the protein balance is really delicate and its quite easy to over do; thus, consider laying off the proteins and focus on moisture -- pretty hard to go wrong with moisture for relaxed hair . . .

 

[Nice]

Do you believe that women with thick hair need more moisture than protein and women with thin hair need more protein (with moisture) that someone with thick hair.

 

[caress]

I have read that fine hair (meaning thin strands of hair) needs more protein.

 

[Cleo]

[ QUOTE ]
caress said:
I have read that fine hair (meaning thin strands of hair) needs more protein.

[/ QUOTE ]

That makes sense to me.

 

[Neroli]

[ QUOTE ]
Nice said:
Do you believe that women with thick hair need more moisture than protein and women with thin hair need more protein (with moisture) that someone with thick hair.

[/ QUOTE ]

I honestly don't know but my very very thick 4b hair definitely thrives on moisture . . .

 

[Leslie_C]

I was looking through the old messages on askdwaynes forum and he seemed to suggest that if your hair is dry brittle and/or breaking, it needs a mixture of moisture and protein. He suggested mixing a reconstructor with a moisturizing conditioner and deep conditioning with that weekly or biweekly for 6 treatments, and then use it as needed. He also said it wont stop immediately, it takes days sometimes to see improvement. Im gonna try this and Ill let u know...Ive had the same problems with protein/moisture.

The thing is our hair needs both and its hard for us nonexperts to know what the balance is. I think it really depends on the condition of the hair...

 

[Mestiza]

This is a good topic b/c it confuses me, too. How do you know when to do which or when your hair has enough of which?

 

[terica]

[ QUOTE ]
keylargo said:
I think this method works better for me too. My hair is VERY sensitive to protein. I thought my hair was breaking so much because I needed more protein or the products that I was using for protein were not working. So, I would switch from product to product trying to stop breakage. I don't know what made it click in me to stop using the protein based products for a while.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm wondering if this is my problem as well. Sometimes I can't tell if my hair is breaking or shedding. I get really long strands all the time (my hair is 11-13"), then I'll have a few short pieces here and there. I have always made sure I used protein, but I'm wondering if I'm using too much. Can someone recommend some good NO Protein moisturizers?

 

[Tene]

I notice one or two shorts also sometimes along with long strands. Some of the short strands have a white bulb on the end.

 

[keylargo]

some good non-protein conditioners:
Keracare Humecto
Loreal Nature's Therapy Mega Moisture
Pantene Relaxed & Natural
Neutrogena Triple Moisture Recovery Mask
Kenra Moisturizing Conditioner (has wheat protein but still is very moisturizing to me)

 

[Honeyhips]

I'm so confused.

 

[northernbelle]

According to the September 2004 edition of ESSENCE Magazine, the Hair article suggests alternating weekly between protein and moisturizing treatments. This gives the hair an equal balance of both treatments.

I receive a professional reconstructing (protein) treatment two times between relaxer touch ups. I receive relaxer touch ups every eight weeks. So, according to the ESSENCE article, my hair is not receiving enough protein.

The week following my relaxer, I applied a protein treatment - Joico K-Pak. I also began using ORS Carrot Oil nightly on my ends. I have seen a marked improvement in the appearance and the texture of my hair.

So, I plan to alternate between the protein and the moisturizing treatments, as sort of an experiment. I am curious if this method will improve my hair over the long run.

northernbelle

 

[moneychaser]

I think I have a happy medium
I deep condition my hair with a protein treatment (30 min w/heat) and follow up with a moisturizing conditioner (5 minutes w/o heat) every three days. My hair has thriving off this routine. The first two washes after my relaxer I deep condition with an intense moisturizing conditioner. Every six weeks I do a hard core protein

My hair is colored, I need protein to keep my hair strong.

 

[Leslie_C]

Denali, would u mind sharing which products u use and when? What do u use every 3 days? I always love input on this.

My first wash after my touchup(got one Friday) I plan to deep condition with Miss Keys 10 n 1 for about an hour or Salerm Wheat Germ Mask. Next wash deep condition with Humecress. The 2nd week I plan to use my design essentials 6 in 1 reconstructor or nexxus emergencee. I wash every 3 days too.

 

[Tene]

That's what I'm trying to figure out. I was having a little breakage and I did Aphogee Treatment yesterday and my hair isn't breaking anymore. I'm wondering what was causing the breakage. I don't know if it was a products I tried or too much or too little protein or too much moisture. My hair was fine last month with no problems.