WTH!? SO ANNOYED W/ PROTEIN AND MOISTURE

[chelleypie810]

So this protein/ moisture is kicking my arse. I thought I had needed moisture because I was having awful breakage, well its three weeks later and I still have awful breakage and I'm thinking about doing hardcore protein treat using Ion 3-Step Emergency Hair Repair Kit. It claims to:

Safe for color treated and permed hair
Helps stop hair breakage
Thickens hair up to 26%
Reduces heat damage up to 56%
Increases hair strength 60%
Repairs split ends

The Ion 3-Step Emergency Service Hair Repair Kit features the most dermatologically advanced hair repair solutions developed by a major pharmaceutical company, and comprised of three unique formulas. Each formula is designed to repair specific areas of the hair shaft. The system helps repair and strengthen dry, damaged brittle hair and returns hair to virgin-like state.

http://www.sallybeauty.com/hair-repair-kit/SBS-302080,default,pd.html

anyway maybe because I'm 7 weeks post and its around the time I normally perm that it's beginning to break off. I don't know This is so irritating. Then come to find out my ends are porous? Is that even possible? When I did the sink test, only my ends sunk. This comes with a ph balancer so my porosity would be in control after using this also. Well this week I'm going to try it. I've been keeping my hair in a bun, just scarfing every night so I don't have to manipulate and get more breakage.

Someone help!
TIA

 

[chelleypie810]

bumping. bumping.

 

[SelfStyled]

Do you have anything lighter you could try first like Aphogee 2 min?

Also a little bit more about you reggie might be helpful, how often you was, do you use heat, etc....

I am going through this right now too, so I definitely can relate.

 

[chelleypie810]

Do you have anything lighter you could try first like Aphogee 2 min?

Also a little bit more about you reggie might be helpful, how often you was, do you use heat, etc....

I am going through this right now too, so I definitely can relate.

Maybe I will go get the ion reconstructor packet. But anyway my reggie has been:

Cleansing w/ WEN or Hair One
DC w/ AOHSR or Ion extreme moisture conditioner
HE LTR leave in or beyond the zone last call leave in

-Airdry and bun or airdry and flat iron (probably 2-3x a month)
-Mostly been bunning for the past 2 months.

 

[GaiasDaughter24]

I'm not good with the moisture/protein balance thing. I had too much moisture and was breaking terribly. I did the 2 min and it did nothing. I did the hard Aphogee treatment and it did nothing. I added MT and now my breakage has finally slowed down significantly. But now my hair feel a little rough. I can't tell if that means it's just stronger and my hair loves protein or if I've done too much. My breakage has slowed so I guess that's good. Now, I'm doing moisture for the next week and see what happens. Ugh, it's so confusing!!!! Sorry for my rant. I don't have any advice I can only relate

BTW, what's the sink test?

 

[chelleypie810]

I'm not good with the moisture/protein balance thing. I had too much moisture and was breaking terribly. I did the 2 min and it did nothing. I did the hard Aphogee treatment and it did nothing. I added MT and now my breakage has finally slowed down significantly. But now my hair feel a little rough. I can't tell if that means it's just stronger and my hair loves protein or if I've done too much. My breakage has slowed so I guess that's good. Now, I'm doing moisture for the next week and see what happens. Ugh, it's so confusing!!!! Sorry for my rant. I don't have any advice I can only relate

BTW, what's the sink test?

Take a piece of hair and put in a cup full of water. If it sinks your hair is porous, and it floats your hair is healthy.

 

[SelfStyled]

Chelley do you think it might be the direct heat? If you were to stretch a piece of hair would it just snap, or would it stretch some and then snap. Also is it breaking at the line of demarcation?

 

[chelleypie810]

Chelley do you think it might be the direct heat? If you were to stretch a piece of hair would it just snap, or would it stretch some and then snap. Also is it breaking at the line of demarcation?

Thats the thing, last wk i took a piece of hair and it stretched then snapped. I was like yyyeeeaaaa finally balanced! apparently i was wrong. I don't think it snapped at the demarcation line. Let me go get a piece of hair off the bathroom floor. I was using heat weekly before and my hair wasn't doing this either. Could it be the weather??? Its been cold in fl and my hair isn't used to this! I was also using protein a little more frequently, but my hair always felt so hard. I hate that! Plus the wen and hair one have wheat protein in it.

 

[Chaosbutterfly]

It actually makes sense for hair to be more porous at the ends.
Hair becomes porous when the cuticles don't lay flat along the cortex, due to damage (including chemical processing) or because they have been opened mechanically. Because the ends of the hair are oldest, and usually go through more hell than the roots, it makes sense that the cuticles there would have more difficulty staying closed.
My ends are the same way, so when I use my PC, I concentrate it on the ends and only use a little on the shaft and roots.

I agree with self styled, that you should first try a milder protein treatment before resorting to the heavier one. You can try leaving it on for 10 minutes, and then following up with a moisturizing DC. I think 10 is what it says on the bottle as the max.

And just my two cents, I think you should try cutting back on the heat. If you're getting frequent breakage, and you've tried everything else, frequent heat just may be the culprit. Especially if you're ironing from root to tip, with an iron at or exceeding 400 degrees F.

hth, and good luck.

 

[SelfStyled]

Thats the thing, last wk i took a piece of hair and it stretched then snapped. I was like yyyeeeaaaa finally balanced! apparently i was wrong. I don't think it snapped at the demarcation line. Let me go get a piece of hair off the bathroom floor. I was using heat weekly before and my hair wasn't doing this either. Could it be the weather??? Its been cold in fl and my hair isn't used to this! I was also using protein a little more frequently, but my hair always felt so hard. I hate that! Plus the wen and hair one have wheat protein in it.

It absolutely could be the weather. As far as I know wheat protein is really moisturizing.

I would try clariying and then a light protein treatment followed by a moisturizing DC. If you are still having breakage then I would try the ION.

Let us know what happens.

 

[chelleypie810]

I will def. go buy the ion reconstructor packet..ugh I love this stuff and then use aohsr. and then use the ph balancer when done. I hope this curbs some breakage. I also noticed when I used my chi keratin mist after I let my bun down it curbed some of the breakage, so it could absolutely be protein that I need.

 

[C@ssandr@]

Whenever I have breakage issues I go into low-mani mode. Me constantly dealing with my hair when it's over proteinated or over moisturized usually makes the problem worse. I agree, you should try a light protein, airdry and see what happens for a day or two. Once I've calmed down (you know we start to fret over it...) it's easier to figure out the problem.

 

[SelfStyled]

Whenever I can't figure out my hair,I always go back and read Sistaslick's articles.

This gives some excellent tips...

http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...ing_or_breakage_understanding_pg5.html?cat=69

"Well, occasionally, over the course of your new regimen, you will notice times where your hair and your breakage are simply, "unreadable" and do not respond to your attempts to treat them. Many times, hair that does not respond to treatment is burdened with product buildup. Even the lightest products can accumulate and build up on the hair shaft rendering your moisturizing and protein replacement efforts futile. Other times, the reason hair does not respond positively to treatment is because the underlying problem has been misdiagnosed, and the wrong treatment has been applied (i.e. more protein on hair with protein overload, or more moisture on over-moisturized hair).

The following regimen is a remedy for hair that is not responding to your attempts to treat it. This treatment can also be done as a once monthly maintenance step in your regular clarifying schedule. Since this is a "stripping wash" (you are essentially stripping your hair of products and natural oils and getting it back to the bare essentials), this treatment should be done only once or twice per month, followed by a deep conditioning. Subsequent washings should be done according to your hair's needs, and always with a gentle sulfate-free shampoo.

To begin:
1.) Clarify the hair with a strong ,sodium lauryl and/or ammonium lauryl sulfate shampoo like Pantene Pro-V Purity. Any shampoo that indicates clarifying ability will be fine. Thoroughly saturate your hair with warm running water for 5 minutes to remove any topical debris on the strands and scalp. Apply your shampoo. Allow your shampoo to rest on the hair for five minutes undisturbed to ensure that the surfactants bind properly to dirt and oils. Rinse the shampoo thoroughly, and repeat.

2.) Then, apply a mild protein conditioner like Aphogee 2 min keratin reconstructor or Motions CPR to the hair for about 10 minutes, then rinse.

3.) Next, apply a moisturizing deep conditioner like Crème of Nature Nourishing Conditioner, Kenra Moisturizing Conditioner, KeraCare Humecto, or Elucence Moisture Benefits Conditioner for 30-45 minutes under a plastic cap with heat. *Alternatively, you can combine steps 2 and 3 and apply the two conditioners together and then go under a plastic cap and heat for 30 minutes. Either way should be fine.

4.) At this point, your hair should be cleaned and conditioned and you should be able to determine whether or not your next product step needs to include more moisture or more protein. (Please refer to my article on protein and moisture balancing for more help with this).

5.) Your last step should always include sealing the hair with an oil of your choice.


Now, in this treatment, you have addressed both a protein and moisture need. More attention is given to moisturizing in this treatment because 90% of hair issues stem from a lack of moisture in the hair. Because it is much easier to overdo protein, and much easier to underdo moisture, this treatment errs on the side of caution and assumes there is a moisture deficit. Giving the hair too much moisture does not have the same devastating effects that overdoing protein does, and too much moisture in the hair can easily be corrected.

So, why do we treat ambiguous hair with both moisture and protein?
Your ambiguous hair might actually be caused by a lack of both protein AND moisture at the same time. The light protein step helps insure that moisture binds and remains within the hairshaft by gently reinforcing the cuticle layers. Even if your breakage problems are purely moisture based, you may not be retaining the moisture you desperately need because your hair lacks a sound protein structure.

This treatment should effectively free up the hair shaft and allow you to better determine the cause of your hair problems. In fact, STEP 1, the clarifying step, may provide you with all the information you need without resorting to the rest of the regimen.

Note: If you are attempting to treat an obvious protein overload, this sample regimen will not work for you. If you are looking for a regimen to help with protein overload, follow this treatment but omit STEP 2 that calls for additional protein. At STEP 4, proceed with a moisturizing leave in conditioner and moisturizer of your choice. Keep in mind that protein induced breakage takes a few weeks or several washes to clear up. Though it may not appear to be responding to treatment, each wash is lessening the hold of the protein on your hair. These proteins bind to your hair cuticle, heavier treatments will bind more strongly than others and may take time to completely remove.

Whenever your hair is acting ambiguous or strange, bring it back to square one. Clarify it, and see where you stand!

Hth.

 

[SelfStyled]

Bumpin for Chelley

 

[chelleypie810]

Bumpin for Chelley

Thank You! About to read!

 

[chelleypie810]

I've decided to use my ion effective treatment because it's already down in my cabinet. This has both protein and moisture in it. I really hope it works. Wash day is thur. so I will update then. But I've been leaving my hair in my bun with my clip in ext. so I've not manipulated my hair since sun.

 

[CenteredGirl]

I've been on hair boards for 6 years now. I am natural. My hair hasn't thrived until recently. Here's some advice worth considering:

How much product do you put on your hair between washes? If you do so frequently, you'll need to wash your hair twice. Nothing like squeekly clean hair.

don't over DC, it will make your hair limp and break off.

I only DC every 6 weeks AND I minimize my product use (about a quater size for my lenth of hair which is now full almost APL.

 

[chelleypie810]

I've been on hair boards for 6 years now. I am natural. My hair hasn't thrived until recently. Here's some advice worth considering:

How much product do you put on your hair between washes? If you do so frequently, you'll need to wash your hair twice. Nothing like squeekly clean hair.

don't over DC, it will make your hair limp and break off.

I only DC every 6 weeks AND I minimize my product use (about a quater size for my lenth of hair which is now full almost APL.

I admit that I do put something in my hair almost everyday. Mostly a moisturizer or some type of leave in, but I use very little because I have thin/fine hair and don't like my hair to be weighed down. I have to DC weekly or at least 1 every 2 weeks. That's how its been since I was little and my hair thrived, so DCing is necessary for me. At this point I think it's either protein because I tried to cut that out or the weather and me wearing my hair out.

 

[CenteredGirl]

I admit that I do put something in my hair almost everyday. Mostly a moisturizer or some type of leave in, but I use very little because I have thin/fine hair and don't like my hair to be weighed down. I have to DC weekly or at least 1 every 2 weeks. That's how its been since I was little and my hair thrived, so DCing is necessary for me. At this point I think it's either protein because I tried to cut that out or the weather and me wearing my hair out.

My hair is fine also, but if yours thrives with DC - go head nah. I would suggest you at least try washing twice next time. You'd be suprised how little shampoo you need on the second go round to clear out any buildup. Let us know your decision/progress. Good luck ChelleyPie.

 

[chelleypie810]

My hair is fine also, but if yours thrives with DC - go head nah. I would suggest you at least try washing twice next time. You'd be suprised how little shampoo you need on the second go round to clear out any buildup. Let us know your decision/progress. Good luck ChelleyPie.

I will def lather twice! That is something that I don't do. I'll clarify twice on wash day!

 

[BrooklynSouth]

Whenever I can't figure out my hair,I always go back and read Sistaslick's articles.

This gives some excellent tips...

http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...ing_or_breakage_understanding_pg5.html?cat=69

"Well, occasionally, over the course of your new regimen, you will notice times where your hair and your breakage are simply, "unreadable" and do not respond to your attempts to treat them. Many times, hair that does not respond to treatment is burdened with product buildup. Even the lightest products can accumulate and build up on the hair shaft rendering your moisturizing and protein replacement efforts futile. Other times, the reason hair does not respond positively to treatment is because the underlying problem has been misdiagnosed, and the wrong treatment has been applied (i.e. more protein on hair with protein overload, or more moisture on over-moisturized hair).

The following regimen is a remedy for hair that is not responding to your attempts to treat it. This treatment can also be done as a once monthly maintenance step in your regular clarifying schedule. Since this is a "stripping wash" (you are essentially stripping your hair of products and natural oils and getting it back to the bare essentials), this treatment should be done only once or twice per month, followed by a deep conditioning. Subsequent washings should be done according to your hair's needs, and always with a gentle sulfate-free shampoo.

To begin:
1.) Clarify the hair with a strong ,sodium lauryl and/or ammonium lauryl sulfate shampoo like Pantene Pro-V Purity. Any shampoo that indicates clarifying ability will be fine. Thoroughly saturate your hair with warm running water for 5 minutes to remove any topical debris on the strands and scalp. Apply your shampoo. Allow your shampoo to rest on the hair for five minutes undisturbed to ensure that the surfactants bind properly to dirt and oils. Rinse the shampoo thoroughly, and repeat.

2.) Then, apply a mild protein conditioner like Aphogee 2 min keratin reconstructor or Motions CPR to the hair for about 10 minutes, then rinse.

3.) Next, apply a moisturizing deep conditioner like Crème of Nature Nourishing Conditioner, Kenra Moisturizing Conditioner, KeraCare Humecto, or Elucence Moisture Benefits Conditioner for 30-45 minutes under a plastic cap with heat. *Alternatively, you can combine steps 2 and 3 and apply the two conditioners together and then go under a plastic cap and heat for 30 minutes. Either way should be fine.

4.) At this point, your hair should be cleaned and conditioned and you should be able to determine whether or not your next product step needs to include more moisture or more protein. (Please refer to my article on protein and moisture balancing for more help with this).

5.) Your last step should always include sealing the hair with an oil of your choice.


Now, in this treatment, you have addressed both a protein and moisture need. More attention is given to moisturizing in this treatment because 90% of hair issues stem from a lack of moisture in the hair. Because it is much easier to overdo protein, and much easier to underdo moisture, this treatment errs on the side of caution and assumes there is a moisture deficit. Giving the hair too much moisture does not have the same devastating effects that overdoing protein does, and too much moisture in the hair can easily be corrected.

So, why do we treat ambiguous hair with both moisture and protein?
Your ambiguous hair might actually be caused by a lack of both protein AND moisture at the same time. The light protein step helps insure that moisture binds and remains within the hairshaft by gently reinforcing the cuticle layers. Even if your breakage problems are purely moisture based, you may not be retaining the moisture you desperately need because your hair lacks a sound protein structure.

This treatment should effectively free up the hair shaft and allow you to better determine the cause of your hair problems. In fact, STEP 1, the clarifying step, may provide you with all the information you need without resorting to the rest of the regimen.

Note: If you are attempting to treat an obvious protein overload, this sample regimen will not work for you. If you are looking for a regimen to help with protein overload, follow this treatment but omit STEP 2 that calls for additional protein. At STEP 4, proceed with a moisturizing leave in conditioner and moisturizer of your choice. Keep in mind that protein induced breakage takes a few weeks or several washes to clear up. Though it may not appear to be responding to treatment, each wash is lessening the hold of the protein on your hair. These proteins bind to your hair cuticle, heavier treatments will bind more strongly than others and may take time to completely remove.

Whenever your hair is acting ambiguous or strange, bring it back to square one. Clarify it, and see where you stand!

Hth.

Absolutely!!! I must have read that post more than a dozen times but still had problems until one day it all just clicked and after a few trip ups have it down..best article ever about moisture/protein balancing.

 

[KrystalClear]

Just my suggestion, going off of the comment about putting PC on the ends, maybe you should try to do the PC to correct the ends that you said sunk? Maybe they aren't taking well to the products or holding onto the moisture. I am some what having issues with breakage too, but i did PC and my hair def is doing much better. I plan to try the Aphogee 2 min reconstructor this weekend on Saturday to see if my hair needs protein.

 

[divachyk]

Good advice within this thread. I battle frequently from moisture/protein imbalance but my hair seems to respond best when erring on the side of moisture rather than using protein as often as many. Previously, I was trying to incorporate protein (aphogee 2min) weekly because every one else was. My hair loved it initially but just recently, the scale seemed to tip on the side of protein overload and my hair was breaking left and right. I backed off the protein and stuck with moisture and that helped tremendously. Now, I plan to use protein every few weeks to ensure the moisture has the structure to bind to much like the sistaslick article suggested. Her article provides great detail. Good luck.