It's Settled my Hair Hates Cones

[AtlantaJJ]

After reading multiple raves I tried the NTM line, the Elasta DPR-11, and a couple of other cone products I used them and my hair just looks like a dull greasy mess when I use them. I am always disappointed. I am going to do a good clarify wash and then DC for a couple of hours and just stick with the Cone Free Conditioners. I just bought a line from Redkin (smooth) that I think has cones, I'm going to march it back to the store too! I'm eyeballing a line by Salerm...all natural. I think my hair likes natural plant based ingreds....and oils.

No more cones for me!

Has anyone else had this experience with cones or is my hair just wierd ?

 

[Ms Lala]

I just learned this earlier this month about my hair. I thought it was mineral oil and petroleum at first drying my hair out. But I was still having the issue after eliminating these ingredients. ONCe I stopped using my Con shampoo (ton of cones) I noticed a great improvement. Now I have to find a new moisturizer I just realized it has a nonwater soluble cone in it.

 

[Cichelle]

You are not the only one. Lots of people love cones. But my experience is that they work well the first or second use...then everything goes down hill. I can tolerate Amodimethicone in small doses as long as I clarify regularly. But at this point, I avoid all cones to save myself the trouble. They invariably dry out my hair and make it feel like plastic.

 

[ritzbitz78]

I just learned this earlier this month about my hair. I thought it was mineral oil and petroleum at first drying my hair out. But I was still having the issue after eliminating these ingredients. ONCe I stopped using my Con shampoo (ton of cones) I noticed a great improvement. Now I have to find a new moisturizer I just realized it has a nonwater soluble cone in it.

Try qhemet biologic's Sidr Butter Balm... it has no cones and is a WONDERFUL moisturizer.

I bought a moisturizer that had great moisture ingredients, but was full of cones. My hair hates it and feels like dry straw. But I had given it to my sister to use on her braids. Her hair seems to love cones... it was so moisturized and gorgeous.

 

[preciousjewel76]

I just learned this earlier this month about my hair. I thought it was mineral oil and petroleum at first drying my hair out. But I was still having the issue after eliminating these ingredients. ONCe I stopped using my Con shampoo (ton of cones) I noticed a great improvement. Now I have to find a new moisturizer I just realized it has a nonwater soluble cone in it.

Creme of Nature shampoo?? I use the detangling/conditioning formula (green label), and it only has one cone - dimethicone copolyol. It's water soluble.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

You are not the only one. Lots of people love cones. But my experience is that they work well the first or second use...then everything goes down hill. I can tolerate Amodimethicone in small doses as long as I clarify regularly. But at this point, I avoid all cones to save myself the trouble. They invariably dry out my hair and make it feel like plastic.

That is the exact description that I couldn't put into words, that's how my hair feels on cons !!

 

[ubavka123]

I ditched them several months ago and I haven't turned back. My hair was always dry and brittle while using them.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Try qhemet biologic's Sidr Butter Balm... it has no cones and is a WONDERFUL moisturizer.

I bought a moisturizer that had great moisture ingredients, but was full of cones. My hair hates it and feels like dry straw. But I had given it to my sister to use on her braids. Her hair seems to love cones... it was so moisturized and gorgeous.

I definately plan to try her line. That's exactly what I was thinking, the detangler and the leave in with one of the butter s / balms.... Now why it works on your sisters hair and not ours, big mystery. Every shampoo and conditioner in the grocery stores all have dimethicone in them.. that's like kryptonite to my hair! LOL

 

[douglala]

My hair HATES cones also. I can't use any products (shampoo, conditioner, moisturizer) that has cones close to the top of the ingredient list. I already know from many past experiences that it won't work for my hair.

But my hair LOVES all types of oils and butters........

 

[HoneyDew]

There are products that do so well for my hair that contain cones, so I think I have a problem with some other ingredients. It's funny how we all have different ingredients that work or not.

I have found out that my hair does not like Glycerin. Everytime I use aproduct with it, my hair feels nasty and coated and does not take moisturizer well.

I can't use CON shampoo either, Ms LaLa, but for me it is the Balsam that my hair does not like. I stopped using that stuff and my have has been SO MUCh better!!

 

[sareca]

You are not the only one. Lots of people love cones. But my experience is that they work well the first or second use...then everything goes down hill. I can tolerate Amodimethicone in small doses as long as I clarify regularly. But at this point, I avoid all cones to save myself the trouble. They invariably dry out my hair and make it feel like plastic.

I've noticed that too! But my hair starts breaking after the 3 or 4th use. My hair tolerates Amodimethicone (in Vive for women of color) too. The only other exception is NTM. When I use it my hair starts looking dull, but doesn't break and it is so soft. So I've continued to use it in small doses.

 

[preciousjewel76]

My hair isn't crazy about cones either. I try to use cone-free products, or make sure the cone content is minimal in the products I use. Right off the top of my head, I know that in S-Curl contains simethicone - I use S-Curl 2x/week to help detangle before washing. However, I shampoo once a week, so the simethicone doesn't seem ato be building up.

 

[Ms_Twana]

Yeah, I had to ditch cones too. I had to find out what all the rave was about with NTM. I absolutely loved it. Then I had to try HE Hello Hydration. I loved that too. Then I flat ironed and my hair did not move. I always have plenty of bounce. Then the Hello Hydration didn't work anymore. And my hair became hard and brittle. Before I joined the forum and became a PJ, I only used Nexxus products. Most of them are cone free. So, I attributed it to cones. I haven't thought about mineral oil or petroleum though. But, I'm tryin to get my hair back on track now. And it is back to being nice and soft when it's dry. But it still feels brittle as soon as water hits it. Then once I use conditioner, it gets soft again. But once I rinse the conditioner out, it's not as hard as before, but it's not as soft as with the conditioner either. But then it air dries really soft. So, I don't know!!!

 

[PaperClip]

Had to get off the 'cone wagon, although there are a couple of products that have the "a" cone FAR DOWN the ingredient list so I try to be careful. I'm thinking there's a balance/fine line in using them sparingly, but less to none is probably better.

Glad you're figuring out your hair preferences!

 

[AtlantaJJ]

I am going to do a good clarify poo, what would be a good moisturizing deep conditioner, and please don't say humetco...my hair hates mineral oil just about as bad as it does cons! LOL I got a big ole jug of humteco that I think I'm going to use on my feet! LOL

How about ORS hair mayo... I remember using that a long time ago and I think I liked it. It was between a braiding (took them down and then put them back up) so I didn't really get to feel the full benefits. I know everyone loves ORS Replenish packs but I want a good deep moisturizing conditioner without protein.
.

 

[preciousjewel76]

I am going to do a good clarify poo, what would be a good moisturizing deep conditioner, and please don't say humetco...my hair hates mineral oil just about as bad as it does cons! LOL I got a big ole jug of humteco that I think I'm going to use on my feet! LOL

How about ORS hair mayo... I remember using that a long time ago and I think I liked it. It was between a braiding (took them down and then put them back up) so I didn't really get to feel the full benefits. I know everyone loves ORS Replenish packs but I want a good deep moisturizing conditioner without protein.
.

I don't know what you have on hand, but I used some Elucence conditioner mixed with Suave Humectant last weekend for DC, and my hair was super moisturized. The Elucence has a little bit of protein in it, I believe. I also really l ike Lustrasilk Cholesterol Plus (the one with shea & mango butter), mixed with an oil.

 

[Aveena]

Yeah, I had to ditch cones too. I had to find out what all the rave was about with NTM. I absolutely loved it. Then I had to try HE Hello Hydration. I loved that too. Then I flat ironed and my hair did not move. I always have plenty of bounce. Then the Hello Hydration didn't work anymore. And my hair became hard and brittle. Before I joined the forum and became a PJ, I only used Nexxus products. Most of them are cone free. So, I attributed it to cones. I haven't thought about mineral oil or petroleum though. But, I'm tryin to get my hair back on track now. And it is back to being nice and soft when it's dry. But it still feels brittle as soon as water hits it. Then once I use conditioner, it gets soft again. But once I rinse the conditioner out, it's not as hard as before, but it's not as soft as with the conditioner either. But then it air dries really soft. So, I don't know!!!

You might be on to something. This is exactly like my hair. I have to check the ingredients of my products tonight.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

I don't know what you have on hand, but I used some Elucence conditioner mixed with Suave Humectant last weekend for DC, and my hair was super moisturized. The Elucence has a little bit of protein in it, I believe. I also really l ike Lustrasilk Cholesterol Plus (the one with shea & mango butter), mixed with an oil.

I have this!! I can mix it with some almond or avocodo oil. Excellent idea! I kinda forgot I had it

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Yeah, I had to ditch cones too. I had to find out what all the rave was about with NTM. I absolutely loved it. Then I had to try HE Hello Hydration. I loved that too. Then I flat ironed and my hair did not move. I always have plenty of bounce. Then the Hello Hydration didn't work anymore. And my hair became hard and brittle. Before I joined the forum and became a PJ, I only used Nexxus products. Most of them are cone free. So, I attributed it to cones. I haven't thought about mineral oil or petroleum though. But, I'm tryin to get my hair back on track now. And it is back to being nice and soft when it's dry. But it still feels brittle as soon as water hits it. Then once I use conditioner, it gets soft again. But once I rinse the conditioner out, it's not as hard as before, but it's not as soft as with the conditioner either. But then it air dries really soft. So, I don't know!!!

Have you tried a good clarify poo? I'm going to do one the next time I wash and someone who just went to Balisi to get her hair done said she left the clarifying poo on for a few minutes to let it work it's magic... I guess it takes a minute to get them dag gone cones off the strands... then I would definately DC for a couple of hours...that's my plan!

 

[AtlantaJJ]

I don't know what you have on hand, but I used some Elucence conditioner mixed with Suave Humectant last weekend for DC, and my hair was super moisturized. The Elucence has a little bit of protein in it, I believe. I also really l ike Lustrasilk Cholesterol Plus (the one with shea & mango butter), mixed with an oil.

Suave, doesn't have cones? I'm impressed! I thought everything in the doggone drug store had a cone in it!

 

[preciousjewel76]

Suave, doesn't have cones? I'm impressed! I thought everything in the doggone drug store had a cone in it!

Oh, it does have a cone in it! I'm sorry I brought it up! I thought it was a water-soluble one, but it's not:

Water (Aqua), Cetearyl Alcohol, Cetrimonium Chloride, Dimethiconol, Fragrance (Parfum), Quaternium-18, Potassium Chloride, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Propylene Glycol, Disodium EDTA, DMDM Hydantoin, TEA-Dodecylbenzenesulfonate, Glycerin, Tocopheryl Acetate [Vitamin E Acetate], Arginine HCl, Lysine HCl, Panthenol, Panthenyl Ethyl Ether, Hair Keratin Amino Acids, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Silk Amino Acids, Methylisothiazolinone

I don't use this very often though, so it's probably not building up on my hair, but dang! I *so* wanted to love it!

 

[Ms Lala]

Creme of Nature shampoo?? I use the detangling/conditioning formula (green label), and it only has one cone - dimethicone copolyol. It's water soluble.

you are right is only has PEG12 dimethicone and it is water soluble but my hair hates this stuff, i thought it was the cone. it dries my hair out something terrible. i wonder what it is? anybody know.

my ors olive oil lotion is the one with the cone that isn't water soluble, i was so upset. maybe it's the combination of the 2 but my hair has been doing much better without the cream of nature.

 

[preciousjewel76]

Have you tried a good clarify poo? I'm going to do one the next time I wash and someone who just went to Balisi to get her hair done said she left the clarifying poo on for a few minutes to let it work it's magic... I guess it takes a minute to get them dag gone cones off the strands... then I would definately DC for a couple of hours...that's my plan!

I do this when I shampoo. I found a website that lists the solvents (in shampoos) that will get rid of specific silicone products - I can't find it right now, though!. It seems that even a mild solvent (like the ones in CON or Elucence shampoos) can remove cones, but they have to sit on the hair for several minutes. Stronger solvents, like SLS, can remove the cones more quickly, but they can also strip moisture from the hair.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Oh, it does have a cone in it! I'm sorry I brought it up! I thought it was a water-soluble one, but it's not:

Water (Aqua), Cetearyl Alcohol, Cetrimonium Chloride, Dimethiconol, Fragrance (Parfum), Quaternium-18, Potassium Chloride, Hydroxyethylcellulose, Propylene Glycol, Disodium EDTA, DMDM Hydantoin, TEA-Dodecylbenzenesulfonate, Glycerin, Tocopheryl Acetate [Vitamin E Acetate], Arginine HCl, Lysine HCl, Panthenol, Panthenyl Ethyl Ether, Hair Keratin Amino Acids, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Silk Amino Acids, Methylisothiazolinone

I don't use this very often though, so it's probably not building up on my hair, but dang! I *so* wanted to love it!

You can love it! It's my funny feathers that don't like the cones, I think it's because my hair strands are fine, I finding they don't like waxy things that coats, it loves light oils though...

 

[PaperClip]

Just wanted to repost this chart re. cones as it was helpful to me recently. The table didn't paste well so it would probably be easier to just use the link.

http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlcolumns/articles.php?id=5341

CurlChemist

What's the Scoop on Silicones?

November 2006

CURLCHEMIST:
Tonya McKay

November 2006
E-mail your questions to Tonya!
We always get lots of questions about silicones, as they are in so many products and are of ongoing concern to many curly-haired consumers. I thought this month we could tackle a couple of those questions in a quick, practical manner (hopefully) to aid in the seemingly never-ending process of ingredient scrutiny and product selection.
Q: Is there any way to rank silicones in order of their water solubility and also recommend the best surfactants to remove each category?
A: It is difficult to actually rank the silicones in order of water solubility, simply because they are usually either soluble or not. Most silicones are water insoluble due to being non-polar, but there are a few that are chemically modified in order to render them more compatible with water. The following table lists the main types of silicones found in hair care formulations. It also indicates whether or not they are water soluble and includes which surfactants can be used to ensure good removal of the silicone from the hair. Studies done by Dow Corning have found that the water-insoluble silicones show no appreciable buildup when a shampoo containing one of the recommended surfactants was used.​

Silicone​

Water soluble?


Recommended cleansing agents


Dimethicone


No

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Dimethiconol​

No

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Phenyl Trimethicone​

No

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Amodimethicone​

No

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Cyclomethicone​

No

cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, other mild surfactants, or conditioner washing​

PEG-modified dimethicone​

Yes

cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, other mild surfactants, or conditioner washing​

Dimethicone copolyol​

Yes

cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, other mild surfactants, or conditioner washing
Q: What is the purpose of silicone in a shampoo? (And also, can a shampoo really be moisturizing?)
A: Many currently available shampoos include silicones in the ingredient list. These additives act as conditioning agents, due to their ability to deposit onto the surface of the hair and form a film during the rinsing phase of the shampooing process.* This helps moisturize the hair by replacing oils stripped from the hair by the cleansing agents in the shampoo. Initially these were marketed as two-in-one products, but now they are found in a wide variety of products, especially as new properties are discovered, such as the ability of some silicones to enhance hair color retention. The inclusion of other oils in a shampoo can have a similarly moisturizing effect.
One interesting thing to note is that a published study in the Journal of Cosmetic science reports finding that the presence of cationic polymer (polyquaternium-10, in this study) significantly decreased the buildup of dimethicone on the hair over time.** The presence of these cationic polymers also enhances the deposition of the silicone onto the surface of the hair. Due to this synergy between the two types of ingredients, they will often be used together by formulators in shampoos.
Silicones offer many benefits, both to the hair care product formulator and the end-user. Careful reading of labels and understanding which silicones require occasional removal with surfactant-containing shampoos can allow the consumer to enjoy all of the good effects of silicones (softness, shine, better color retention, increased manageability), while suffering none of the ill effects of build-up.​

* Marchioretto, S., Optimizing the Use of Silicones in Haircare Products”, Dow Corning Europe, 1998​

** Gruber JV; Lamoureux BR; Joshi N; Moral L, J.Cosmetic Sci; 2004, 52 (2), 131-136, The use of x-ray fluorescent spectroscopy to study the influence of cationic polymers on silicone oil deposition from shampoo​

 

[Ms Lala]

There are products that do so well for my hair that contain cones, so I think I have a problem with some other ingredients. It's funny how we all have different ingredients that work or not.

I have found out that my hair does not like Glycerin. Everytime I use aproduct with it, my hair feels nasty and coated and does not take moisturizer well.

I can't use CON shampoo either, Ms LaLa, but for me it is the Balsam that my hair does not like. I stopped using that stuff and my have has been SO MUCh better!!

Is that what causes the coated feeling? I thought it was cones but someone just told me the cone in CON is water soluble. It's like after I use it my hair won't retain moisture from other products. Even if I have clarified.

 

[shocol]

My hair doesn't like cones either, even if I double up on my moisturizer and leave-ins before using.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Is that what causes the coated feeling? I thought it was cones but someone just told me the cone in CON is water soluble. It's like after I use it my hair won't retain moisture from other products. Even if I have clarified.

Balisi mentions leaving the clarify suds on for a few minutes then rinsing well and deep conditioning. It was also mentioned in this thread to help remove the cones... Sounds like cones have your hair all clogged up with goo like mine!

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Just wanted to repost this chart re. cones as it was helpful to me recently. The table didn't paste well so it would probably be easier to just use the link.

http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlcolumns/articles.php?id=5341

CurlChemist

What's the Scoop on Silicones?

November 2006

CURLCHEMIST:
Tonya McKay

November 2006
E-mail your questions to Tonya!
We always get lots of questions about silicones, as they are in so many products and are of ongoing concern to many curly-haired consumers. I thought this month we could tackle a couple of those questions in a quick, practical manner (hopefully) to aid in the seemingly never-ending process of ingredient scrutiny and product selection.
Q: Is there any way to rank silicones in order of their water solubility and also recommend the best surfactants to remove each category?
A: It is difficult to actually rank the silicones in order of water solubility, simply because they are usually either soluble or not. Most silicones are water insoluble due to being non-polar, but there are a few that are chemically modified in order to render them more compatible with water. The following table lists the main types of silicones found in hair care formulations. It also indicates whether or not they are water soluble and includes which surfactants can be used to ensure good removal of the silicone from the hair. Studies done by Dow Corning have found that the water-insoluble silicones show no appreciable buildup when a shampoo containing one of the recommended surfactants was used.​

Silicone​

Water soluble?​

Recommended cleansing agents​

Dimethicone​

No​

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Dimethiconol​

No​

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Phenyl Trimethicone​

No​

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Amodimethicone​

No​

SLS, SLES, cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, ALS, or ALES​

Cyclomethicone​

No​

cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, other mild surfactants, or conditioner washing​

PEG-modified dimethicone​

Yes​

cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, other mild surfactants, or conditioner washing​

Dimethicone copolyol​

Yes​

cocamidopropyl betaine, cocobetaine, other mild surfactants, or conditioner washing
Q: What is the purpose of silicone in a shampoo? (And also, can a shampoo really be moisturizing?)
A: Many currently available shampoos include silicones in the ingredient list. These additives act as conditioning agents, due to their ability to deposit onto the surface of the hair and form a film during the rinsing phase of the shampooing process.* This helps moisturize the hair by replacing oils stripped from the hair by the cleansing agents in the shampoo. Initially these were marketed as two-in-one products, but now they are found in a wide variety of products, especially as new properties are discovered, such as the ability of some silicones to enhance hair color retention. The inclusion of other oils in a shampoo can have a similarly moisturizing effect.
One interesting thing to note is that a published study in the Journal of Cosmetic science reports finding that the presence of cationic polymer (polyquaternium-10, in this study) significantly decreased the buildup of dimethicone on the hair over time.** The presence of these cationic polymers also enhances the deposition of the silicone onto the surface of the hair. Due to this synergy between the two types of ingredients, they will often be used together by formulators in shampoos.
Silicones offer many benefits, both to the hair care product formulator and the end-user. Careful reading of labels and understanding which silicones require occasional removal with surfactant-containing shampoos can allow the consumer to enjoy all of the good effects of silicones (softness, shine, better color retention, increased manageability), while suffering none of the ill effects of build-up.​

* Marchioretto, S., Optimizing the Use of Silicones in Haircare Products”, Dow Corning Europe, 1998​

** Gruber JV; Lamoureux BR; Joshi N; Moral L, J.Cosmetic Sci; 2004, 52 (2), 131-136, The use of x-ray fluorescent spectroscopy to study the influence of cationic polymers on silicone oil deposition from shampoo​

This is going into my file cabinet!! Thank you RR!

 

[DahomeyAhosi]

I don't think my hair likes cones either. Which means I've had to seriously cut down using Herbal Essences conditioner (