What age do you relax a childs hair???

[nestlequik]

I just can't understand how anyone would want to put caustic chemicals on a child's head. I know there are some that will say they base their child's scalp, they're extra careful, etc., but the bottom line is relaxers are made up of chemicals that can cause damage, whether it's a burn, or hair breakage or worse, hair loss. I can't think of anything right now but what other instance is there when a mother applies something that can damage living tissue on their daughter for the sake of appearance or manageability?

Personally, 4 years old is way too young. And I agree with a lot of the ladies here, what kind of message are you sending to your daughter when you relax her hair that young? I'm not saying it's self hatred, but I do think you're sending subliminal messages to her that can equate with, "your hair is unruly", "your hair is unmanageable", etc, at a young age and these messages can stick with them for a long time. If they didn't, well we wouldn't be having this debate, would we?

 

[aquajoyice]

When that child turns 18 and can do whatever she wants with her hair.

 

[Napp]

when she is old enough to pay for her own relaxers. that is when i got my first one

 

[pocketbookgal]

SOSOSOSOSOSOSOSOS what you are saying is, we should all just relax our hair so that white people can't tell any difference between us negroes and that will end all discrimination. and somehow, being natural and letting them KNOW what our hair REALLY looks like is somehow detrimental?

i see i see i see.

i was relaxed so young i didn't know what my hair looked like till i was 21 years old. to me, that is odd. unless you are born blind, there is no excuse for that. i wouldn't put my children through that. most other children (and i went to a predominantly white school from kindergarten to high school graduation, i'm talking 80% white) of other races do not get their hair permanently processed till at LEAST junior high. i dunno who's tell you you all lies. a WOMAN bleaching her hair is NOT the same as her doing it to her child also.

NOOO that is WHAT YOU SAID....what I meant was that white people dont know our hair type when it is relaxed nor do they care. BUT WHO DOES??? Black people who are judging and carrying on about hair types etc (WHY?? because many of us are still back in the slavery days worrying about who has different hair) when in all actuality no matter what the grade, texture, style, chemical etc. WE ARE THE ORIGINATORS OF IT ALL!!! DONT YOU SEE???? SO THERE IS NO ISSUE WITH DYING OUR HAIR BLONDE, GETTING BLUE CONTACTS ETC?? WHY???---IT IS WHITE PEOPLE THAT HAVE TAUGHT YOU THAT IT IS "CAUCASIAN FEATURES AND THEREFORE IS SUPERIOR!!!""" <<<--anyone who says different is a mind controlled victim of white supremacy!

WE ARE THE ORIGINATORS OF ALL HAIR TYPES, COLORS, THINGS.... LEARN YOUR HISTORY!!!! This is what we need to teach our children. Do your research...

 

[pocketbookgal]

I am not saying that a child should get a relaxer at all. I feel that any permanent change to anyones body should not be made until the child is old enough to maintain and deal with that decision. BUT LET ME ASK YOU THIS????? How many parents on here pierced their child's ear before they asked to have them pierced? This is permanent and if is done in infancy the hole can remain open for life....so that's ok but relaxer is wrong because it makes a permanent change????....People amaze me! I believe children should have a say so before any permanent changes are made. It has nothing to do with chemicals. Chemicals are everywhere. In your food, water, air, furniture, carpet, clothing dyes, etc. If we spent just as much time being just as outraged about the genetically modified peaches in your "organic" yogurt and took this energy to try to get rid of chemicals in everything else OTHER than hair products how much healthier would this world be??? So would I knowingly give a chemical to my child or relax their hair for that matter??? NOOOO....but how many people vaccinate their kids or give them toxic medications for various ailments even though they know it may not be the best for them???? For instance, a relaxer has NOTHING on the FLOURIDE in your bath water, and that toothpaste and mouthwash that baby would use everyday. Where is the outrage there???? NOTHING kills me more but to see "NATURAL" haired women who still allow all this exposure to chemical toxins in their environment, drinking and smoking, using coffee and diet pills, drinking soda, using splenda but oh no....not my hair???!!! GTFO! The hypocrisy just kills me. Again....do your research......let me help you get started....
http://www.ewg.org/

 

[IMFOCSD]

I am not saying that a child should get a relaxer at all. I feel that any permanent change to anyones body should not be made until the child is old enough to maintain and deal with that decision. BUT LET ME ASK YOU THIS????? How many parents on here pierced their child's ear before they asked to have them pierced? This is permanent and if is done in infancy the hole can remain open for life....so that's ok but relaxer is wrong because it makes a permanent change????....People amaze me! I believe children should have a say so before any permanent changes are made. It has nothing to do with chemicals. Chemicals are everywhere. In your food, water, air, furniture, carpet, clothing dyes, etc. If we spent just as much time being just as outraged about the genetically modified peaches in your "organic" yogurt and took this energy to try to get rid of chemicals in everything else OTHER than hair products how much healthier would this world be??? So would I knowingly give a chemical to my child or relax their hair for that matter??? NOOOO....but how many people vaccinate their kids or give them toxic medications for various ailments even though they know it may not be the best for them???? For instance, a relaxer has NOTHING on the FLOURIDE in your bath water, and that toothpaste and mouthwash that baby would use everyday. Where is the outrage there???? NOTHING kills me more but to see "NATURAL" haired women who still allow all this exposure to chemical toxins in their environment, drinking and smoking, using coffee and diet pills, drinking soda, using splenda but oh no....not my hair???!!! GTFO! The hypocrisy just kills me. Again....do your research......let me help you get started....
http://www.ewg.org/

@ the bolded...very good point! seems things are alwasy negative when a person does not agree smh.

Speaking for myself when I got relaxers as a child i did not care..all I wanted weas for my mom to hurry up with my hair so I could go play with my friends and my daughter is the same way..I highly doubt if a littler girl is mature enough to have thoughts about hair like we do..."omg, my mom is relaxing my hair it must be ugly", "it must be nappy" " my mom hates my hair' smh lol

 

[MizzBrown]

We brought up pierced ears??

Got mine done at 6 months old. Folks go hard about ear piercing too. I never knew that until recently.

 

[PrimaD]

@ lilpeach I can agree with you on what you are saying there are many naturals that flip out over what's in the produts they use for hair care, but careless about other way they expose their body to chemicals ect. As for me and my child we live as natural as we can even what we put in our mouth, on our skin ect. But I'm always on my soap box about natural living as well as hair cafe trying to inform those around me about products that they use down to the toothpaste. But we would need to start another thread for that. As for the ear piercing I would never do that to a baby being that I'm informed about those gun they use and that I work in health care. But you know the saying ignorance is bliss.

 

[gcchick_07]

NOOO that is WHAT YOU SAID....what I meant was that white people dont know our hair type when it is relaxed nor do they care. BUT WHO DOES??? Black people who are judging and carrying on about hair types etc (WHY?? because many of us are still back in the slavery days worrying about who has different hair) when in all actuality no matter what the grade, texture, style, chemical etc. WE ARE THE ORIGINATORS OF IT ALL!!! DONT YOU SEE???? SO THERE IS NO ISSUE WITH DYING OUR HAIR BLONDE, GETTING BLUE CONTACTS ETC?? WHY???---IT IS WHITE PEOPLE THAT HAVE TAUGHT YOU THAT IT IS "CAUCASIAN FEATURES AND THEREFORE IS SUPERIOR!!!""" <<<--anyone who says different is a mind controlled victim of white supremacy!

WE ARE THE ORIGINATORS OF ALL HAIR TYPES, COLORS, THINGS.... LEARN YOUR HISTORY!!!! This is what we need to teach our children. Do your research...

saying we are the originators of all hair types and etc is like saying we are also the originators of all diseases as well. all of these are genetic mutations that had nothing to do with the fact that the first men fully evolved in africa. we do not own the rights to blue eyes and blonde hair because it was a genetic mutation. we do not control genetic mutations to adapt to a different environment. do you understand biology very well? saying that we are the "originators" of any genetic mutation is taking credit for something that had nothing to do with people who maintained a certain phenotype elsewhere.

and who cares that white people don't know anything about black people with different hair types (i have no idea why white people are always brought into these discussions past the point of "european standard of beauty", as if they are to prove a point about something).

this "slave think" that you think is so prevalent in the black community happens REGARDLESS of if people have relaxers or not. when i was little you know why i was told i needed a relaxer? because my hair was unmanageable. so even when i had a relaxer, i still felt "lesser" than even WITH the permanently straight hair. or when women see a sign of kinks or curl exiting their scalp they go straight to perm.

so getting a relaxer is just a way to reaffirm our place as the genetic originators? no sorry, unless it is somewhere in your genes to produce a certain phenotype, you cannot "claim" anything. you know who can "claim" it? the ones who mutated that way in the first place for survival (these white people you keep mentioning so much). genetic mutations are out of the hands of the people procreating, you never know when they are going to happen, and trying to take ownership of this is again, like taking claim on cancer (a genetic mutation) since you know, we are the originators.

 

[gcchick_07]

I am not saying that a child should get a relaxer at all. I feel that any permanent change to anyones body should not be made until the child is old enough to maintain and deal with that decision. BUT LET ME ASK YOU THIS????? How many parents on here pierced their child's ear before they asked to have them pierced? This is permanent and if is done in infancy the hole can remain open for life....so that's ok but relaxer is wrong because it makes a permanent change????....People amaze me! I believe children should have a say so before any permanent changes are made. It has nothing to do with chemicals. Chemicals are everywhere. In your food, water, air, furniture, carpet, clothing dyes, etc. If we spent just as much time being just as outraged about the genetically modified peaches in your "organic" yogurt and took this energy to try to get rid of chemicals in everything else OTHER than hair products how much healthier would this world be??? So would I knowingly give a chemical to my child or relax their hair for that matter??? NOOOO....but how many people vaccinate their kids or give them toxic medications for various ailments even though they know it may not be the best for them???? For instance, a relaxer has NOTHING on the FLOURIDE in your bath water, and that toothpaste and mouthwash that baby would use everyday. Where is the outrage there???? NOTHING kills me more but to see "NATURAL" haired women who still allow all this exposure to chemical toxins in their environment, drinking and smoking, using coffee and diet pills, drinking soda, using splenda but oh no....not my hair???!!! GTFO! The hypocrisy just kills me. Again....do your research......let me help you get started....
http://www.ewg.org/

you compare giving children vaccinations to prevent many common child killers that have pretty much been eradicated from our "first world" society to that of using a caustic chemical to permanently straighten a child's hair? where is the benefit to an entire SOCIETY of people to perming a child's hair? do they get to not have polio? mumps? measels? and other common killers that plagued (and still do) a much less scientifically developed society? apples and oranges. oh and that study linking autism with vaccines was debunked. so i hope not a soul brings that up.

 

[brg240]

never, probably. I'd really rather not have those type of chemicals near my future dd's scalp. Also, I want my daughter to completely love her natural texture. Chemicals altering that seem counter productive to me at least.

I begged my mom for a relaxer around 12 and she gave me one. I think (can't remember) i thought it would make my hair easier to do/take less time/be overall less frustrating. Also, my hair would never stay how i wanted it, by the end of the day it would be sticking every which way and it embarrassed me

I remember after my mom relaxed my hair I felt so pretty, all the other black girls i knew had relaxed hair. I never thought my hair was ugly (thought it was pretty even if i hated it), but the straight hair was something else for me.

not sure where i was going with that but likely never, but who knows really.

edit:
A couple people mentioned length but i don't think we should push long hair so much, relaxers are not the only thing that gives girls complexes.

 

[Dayjoy]

edit:
A couple people mentioned length but i don't think we should push long hair so much, relaxers are not the only thing that gives girls complexes.

Great point.

 

[Urban]

Never.

Tell your sister in-law to teach her daughter to love herself as she is first. There'll always be time for relaxers after that.

How bout between 0 -18 (ok maybe even 16) we just tell our daughters that everything about them is beautiful. If you want to change something later, fine. Just learn first that everything part of you is acceptable.

How 'bout it?

 

[nestlequik]

@ lilpeach, thank you for the link, I actually am familiar with the group and their issues, I used to work with them when I was working for a Congressman.

gcchick_07, I fully agree with you. We can't compare life saving vaccinations to a relaxer. And yes, while there are chemicals we're exposed to everyday willingly and unwillingly personally I think if I become a parent I would try to minimize them for the child as much as possible. That includes relaxers.

BTW, I'm really not trying to start anything but I personally do try to eat organic, use organic products on my body, I'm not a smoker, I don't use Splenda, etc. I do try to live as naturally as possible even not owning a car, walking to work, etc. I admit I use chemicals- got some nail polish remover somewhere....But my point is, I think a relaxer for a 4 year old is inappropriate. The chemicals are very irritating especially on a young child's scalp.

Off the soap box I go...

 

[ashleymichelle1]

...........

 

[pocketbookgal]

saying we are the originators of all hair types and etc is like saying we are also the originators of all diseases as well. all of these are genetic mutations that had nothing to do with the fact that the first men fully evolved in africa. we do not own the rights to blue eyes and blonde hair because it was a genetic mutation. we do not control genetic mutations to adapt to a different environment. do you understand biology very well? saying that we are the "originators" of any genetic mutation is taking credit for something that had nothing to do with people who maintained a certain phenotype elsewhere.

and who cares that white people don't know anything about black people with different hair types (i have no idea why white people are always brought into these discussions past the point of "european standard of beauty", as if they are to prove a point about something).

this "slave think" that you think is so prevalent in the black community happens REGARDLESS of if people have relaxers or not. when i was little you know why i was told i needed a relaxer? because my hair was unmanageable. so even when i had a relaxer, i still felt "lesser" than even WITH the permanently straight hair. or when women see a sign of kinks or curl exiting their scalp they go straight to perm.

so getting a relaxer is just a way to reaffirm our place as the genetic originators? no sorry, unless it is somewhere in your genes to produce a certain phenotype, you cannot "claim" anything. you know who can "claim" it? the ones who mutated that way in the first place for survival (these white people you keep mentioning so much). genetic mutations are out of the hands of the people procreating, you never know when they are going to happen, and trying to take ownership of this is again, like taking claim on cancer (a genetic mutation) since you know, we are the originators.

It seems like you may know some things about biology but you need some refreshers. I have 3 degrees in biology and life sciences (including a doctorate and am a professor of biology) by the way so I dont need any lecturing on this subject..... I dont have much time as I am at work right now but if you would like further research and internet and book resources you can PM me and I will help you on your journey into learning.

First and foremost all viruses, prions, bacteria --aka causes of diseases--existed before man (if you believe in evolution) so black people did not create disease...and some cancers are caused by these infective agents...let me clear that up before any more horrendous rumors get out LOL!

There cannot be a genetic mutation without an original being that has the DNA with the CODE for all mutations. Therefore, black people created everything including blonde hair and blue eyes and even *GASPS* STRAIGHT HAIR PATTERNS!!!!!!!!!!....if this were not the case why not have white or yellow colored pupils or six arms???? BECAUSE Its not in the original DNA PROTEIN CODINGS.....so the mutation cannot occur!!!!!!! if its not in the code the mutation cannot happen no matter what the teratogen or the mutagen is!!!!!!!!!!....again do more research as to how genetics work and on the origins of man via not just scientific but also African history and not just the stuff they hand feed you in the Eurocentric school systems (public, private, college and otherwise) and you will see that we were on earth waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay before these other white "mutants" as you would say existed.

No one cares about what white people think for the most part think but unfortunately some black people do as we live in a Eurocentric society in the US and if you read what I wrote you would have seen that is what I was addressing.

"this "slave think" that you think is so prevalent in the black community happens REGARDLESS of if people have relaxers or not. when i was little you know why i was told i needed a relaxer? because my hair was unmanageable." is what you said.

This means that you acknowledge the impact of a Eurocentric society on you and others in the black community regardless of whether or not a person chose to chemically alter their hair.

This means that no matter if you are kinky curly or bone straight in the hair department these issues would not directly impact your self esteem in so much as the current role of society creating a white supremacist background that we all live within western society..... So if someone (not a 4 year old --we have all agreed on that) wants to change their hair to make it more manageable then it must be ok with you then right????? Because even if by relaxing you are "trying to be white" by some people's standards, there will still be discrimination and other negative impacts?????? So if relaxers dont help with self esteem in the race department what will????? Think about what you said and you will see what I mean.

The decision to relax or not to has nothing to do with race or self esteem if you understand that hair or any of your looks for that matter has nothing to do with your self worth. That thinking is just as enslaving as anything else. That is what most other posters wrote and it is a job of the parents.

Where is the line? Makeup ok but relaxer not ok? Henna hair color change ok? But bleach not ok? Waxing eyebrows ok but fake lashes not ok? Manicures ok but nail polish not ok??? All beauty treatments have risks, consequences, and repercussions--including natural ones (ie allergic reactions, phytoestrogens etc--you would be amazed). The chemicals have nothing to do with this obviously.......

 

[pocketbookgal]

you compare giving children vaccinations to prevent many common child killers that have pretty much been eradicated from our "first world" society to that of using a caustic chemical to permanently straighten a child's hair? where is the benefit to an entire SOCIETY of people to perming a child's hair? do they get to not have polio? mumps? measels? and other common killers that plagued (and still do) a much less scientifically developed society? apples and oranges. oh and that study linking autism with vaccines was debunked. so i hope not a soul brings that up.

Vaccines are not what you think they are. Do you know what is in those vaccines?


http://www.vaclib.org/toc.htm#ingredients

http://www.cogforlife.org/fetalvaccines.htm


How about those aborted fetuses? If I had a choice between a relaxer every 6 month and aborted fetus blood....well.....LOL

Education is the key.

 

[BostonMaria]

So over the weekend my lovely sis in law informs me that she wants to relax her DD hair whom is only 5 I like she is too young. The child as lovely thick 4b/c w/e hair. My sis in law has never been one to do hair or keep it up even her DD natual hair. So I got on my soap box about why she shouldn't and the damage she could cause if the hair isn't care for. Also she has pressed this childs hair and there is heat damage. To keep dear ol' sis in law from doing anything crazy to my niece's hair I twisted it. I know, why should I care its not my child. But I would hate for her to become another blad headed little girl due to a relxer. I really hope you ladies can give me idea or sites for my sis in law to look at.

Five is way too young! I honestly think NEVER is a good time for a relaxer, no matter what the age but if you need me to pin point an age I'd say 13+ when they can at least comb their own hair.

There are lots of blogs out there that help with children's hair styles
Here is my favorite: http://beadsbraidsbeyond.blogspot.com/

 

[pocketbookgal]

I am sorry guys if you feel I am hostile or bashing. I feel that there has been more bashing of his poor mother who is also uneducated than anything else. I will admit am a little frustrated with the boards in general. I have been reading on here for a while now and finally decided to start posting about this because I guess my issue is I have seen the back and forth of what is best and the "holier than thou" attitude behind many of the discussions on this subject and I feel it has become another way to divide us and make us have more problems between us. Everyone needs to respect everyone elses decisions about how to take care of and style their hair and no ones opinion is better than any others. That is the point.

Some of the "natural" treatments on here can be just as caustic and have caused side effects also. Many people do not take into consideration the bioaccumulative effect of their natural products and the environment around them. For instance, you may be taking fish oil for hair growth but do you know where that brand came from? Do you know if there is toxic mercury in your "natural" supplement??? Do you know if your hair product is interacting with your other medications and/or supplements?

I am more than happy to educate anyone on what I know but I want people to really think about what they are doing to their bodies and themselves. I know its a hair forum but hair isnt everything and its important to note that other things are needed in order to be healthy and have good self esteem, and not make the natural movement just be about the hair. We as a people need to do better with living a more natural and healthy lifestyle all around and not just let this be another passing "hair fad". Now I am off my soap box oh and yes I am transitioning into natural for the last 2 years or so (I didnt want to BC........being here helped me through for sure!!!!!)

 

[IMFOCSD]

What does relaxing hair have to do with self love?? thats like saying, I relax my hair and my daughters hair so i dont love myself and im teaching her not to love her self.
I understand women dont like thew chemicals in relaxers, but for some women who compare relaxers to self hate, low self esteem, etc....thats crazy.

no one is psychic we dont know why women choose relaxers and for someone to assume negative views about that women just because she relaxes her or her daughters hair is not cool.

Women with natural hair WHO STRAIGHTEN THEIR HAIR would you get upset/offended if someone said "why do you straighten your hair, do you hate yourself or your hair"?

Why cant a person just do them without the negativity..smh..

 

[pocketbookgal]

What does relaxing hair have to do with self love?? thats like saying, I relax my hair and my daughters hair so i dont love myself and im teaching her not to love her self.
I understand women dont like thew chemicals in relaxers, but for some women who compare relaxers to self hate, low self esteem, etc....thats crazy.

no one is psychic we dont know why women choose relaxers and for someone to assume negative views about that women just because she relaxes her or her daughters hair is not cool.

Women with natural hair WHO STRAIGHTEN THEIR HAIR would you get upset/offended if someone said "why do you straighten your hair, do you hate yourself or your hair"?

Why cant a person just do them without the negativity..smh..

If I could triple bump this post for truth I would.

 

[nestlequik]

I am sorry guys if you feel I am hostile or bashing. I feel that there has been more bashing of his poor mother who is also uneducated than anything else. I will admit am a little frustrated with the boards in general. I have been reading on here for a while now and finally decided to start posting about this because I guess my issue is I have seen the back and forth of what is best and the "holier than thou" attitude behind many of the discussions on this subject and I feel it has become another way to divide us and make us have more problems between us. Everyone needs to respect everyone elses decisions about how to take care of and style their hair and no ones opinion is better than any others. That is the point.

Some of the "natural" treatments on here can be just as caustic and have caused side effects also. Many people do not take into consideration the bioaccumulative effect of their natural products and the environment around them. For instance, you may be taking fish oil for hair growth but do you know where that brand came from? Do you know if there is toxic mercury in your "natural" supplement??? Do you know if your hair product is interacting with your other medications and/or supplements?

I am more than happy to educate anyone on what I know but I want people to really think about what they are doing to their bodies and themselves. I know its a hair forum but hair isnt everything and its important to note that other things are needed in order to be healthy and have good self esteem, and not make the natural movement just be about the hair. We as a people need to do better with living a more natural and healthy lifestyle all around and not just let this be another passing "hair fad". Now I am off my soap box oh and yes I am transitioning into natural for the last 2 years or so (I didnt want to BC........being here helped me through for sure!!!!!)

It's tough to convey your thoughts on boards like this b/c we can't hear the inflection in our voices, see facial expressions, etc. We all have opinions about hair so I agree we shouldn't forget that we all deserve respect for each other.
Natural or relaxed, I hope we're all transitioning to a better lifestyle not just taking care of our hair but our minds, bodies and our environment as well.

BTW, I appreciate this dialogue. It's been really interesting. Everyone has given me some things to ponder.

 

[brg240]

What does relaxing hair have to do with self love?? thats like saying, I relax my hair and my daughters hair so i dont love myself and im teaching her not to love her self.
I understand women dont like thew chemicals in relaxers, but for some women who compare relaxers to self hate, low self esteem, etc....thats crazy.

no one is psychic we dont know why women choose relaxers and for someone to assume negative views about that women just because she relaxes her or her daughters hair is not cool.

Women with natural hair WHO STRAIGHTEN THEIR HAIR would you get upset/offended if someone said "why do you straighten your hair, do you hate yourself or your hair"?

Why cant a person just do them without the negativity..smh..

I don't think someone who relaxes necessary hates them self but comments that i've heard from some (not all) relaxed people definitely imply as much. I do think if the vast majority of young girls are getting relaxed it sends a message that there is something wrong with their natural texture or this is the only way that hair can be managed.

No, i really wouldn't be offended. I'd be like no, i straighten because sometimes i like it straight. if they didn't believe me, i'd ignore them. I can't control their thoughts.

 

[IMFOCSD]

I don't think someone who relaxes necessary hates them self but comments that i've heard from some (not all) relaxed people definitely imply as much. I do think if the vast majority of young girls are getting relaxed it sends a message that there is something wrong with their natural texture or this is the only way that hair can be managed.

No, i really wouldn't be offended. I'd be like no, i straighten because sometimes i like it straight. if they didn't believe me, i'd ignore them. I can't control their thoughts.

I totally agree with the bolded and I'm quite sure women who realx their hair feels the same way. My daughter is relaxed and i stretch her relaxers anywhere from 3-6 months. I have never heard her say anything about her hair except it takes too long to comb lol, she is very impatient and im taking time away from her playtime. My daughter knows she is beautiful...whether she is relaxed or natural. She has had a chance to enjoy her hair when it was natural and we enjoyed so many different styles. I decided that I wanted to relax her hair and we both enjoy it this way also, she helps me wash and style my hair and she asks questions about hair..she is even trying to do her own hair..mainly ponytails lol, but they look so neat.

 

[Kash]

you compare giving children vaccinations to prevent many common child killers that have pretty much been eradicated from our "first world" society to that of using a caustic chemical to permanently straighten a child's hair? where is the benefit to an entire SOCIETY of people to perming a child's hair? do they get to not have polio? mumps? measels? and other common killers that plagued (and still do) a much less scientifically developed society? apples and oranges. oh and that study linking autism with vaccines was debunked. so i hope not a soul brings that up.

Thank you! One of the basic rules of Debating: if you have to stoop to extremes to try and prove your point, then sit down and let your team mate do the job.

 

[gcchick_07]

It seems like you may know some things about biology but you need some refreshers. I have 3 degrees in biology and life sciences (including a doctorate and am a professor of biology) by the way so I dont need any lecturing on this subject..... I dont have much time as I am at work right now but if you would like further research and internet and book resources you can PM me and I will help you on your journey into learning.

First and foremost all viruses, prions, bacteria --aka causes of diseases--existed before man (if you believe in evolution) so black people did not create disease...and some cancers are caused by these infective agents...let me clear that up before any more horrendous rumors get out LOL!

There cannot be a genetic mutation without an original being that has the DNA with the CODE for all mutations. Therefore, black people created everything including blonde hair and blue eyes and even *GASPS* STRAIGHT HAIR PATTERNS!!!!!!!!!!....if this were not the case why not have white or yellow colored pupils or six arms???? BECAUSE Its not in the original DNA PROTEIN CODINGS.....so the mutation cannot occur!!!!!!! if its not in the code the mutation cannot happen no matter what the teratogen or the mutagen is!!!!!!!!!!....again do more research as to how genetics work and on the origins of man via not just scientific but also African history and not just the stuff they hand feed you in the Eurocentric school systems (public, private, college and otherwise) and you will see that we were on earth waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay before these other white "mutants" as you would say existed.

No one cares about what white people think for the most part think but unfortunately some black people do as we live in a Eurocentric society in the US and if you read what I wrote you would have seen that is what I was addressing.

"this "slave think" that you think is so prevalent in the black community happens REGARDLESS of if people have relaxers or not. when i was little you know why i was told i needed a relaxer? because my hair was unmanageable." is what you said.

This means that you acknowledge the impact of a Eurocentric society on you and others in the black community regardless of whether or not a person chose to chemically alter their hair.

This means that no matter if you are kinky curly or bone straight in the hair department these issues would not directly impact your self esteem in so much as the current role of society creating a white supremacist background that we all live within western society..... So if someone (not a 4 year old --we have all agreed on that) wants to change their hair to make it more manageable then it must be ok with you then right????? Because even if by relaxing you are "trying to be white" by some people's standards, there will still be discrimination and other negative impacts?????? So if relaxers dont help with self esteem in the race department what will????? Think about what you said and you will see what I mean.

The decision to relax or not to has nothing to do with race or self esteem if you understand that hair or any of your looks for that matter has nothing to do with your self worth. That thinking is just as enslaving as anything else. That is what most other posters wrote and it is a job of the parents.

Where is the line? Makeup ok but relaxer not ok? Henna hair color change ok? But bleach not ok? Waxing eyebrows ok but fake lashes not ok? Manicures ok but nail polish not ok??? All beauty treatments have risks, consequences, and repercussions--including natural ones (ie allergic reactions, phytoestrogens etc--you would be amazed). The chemicals have nothing to do with this obviously.......

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22274113/ns/health-kids_and_parenting/

that girl had 8 limbs. should we go ahead and take credit for that too?

for something to mutate means that it was not there before, there was an ERROR in the original coding making for a different genotype/possible phenotype. so blacks should take claim to an ERROR in coding?

i'm out.

 

[~Sparklingflame~]

Is this really alla THAT????

 

[pocketbookgal]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22274113/ns/health-kids_and_parenting/

that girl had 8 limbs. should we go ahead and take credit for that too?

for something to mutate means that it was not there before, there was an ERROR in the original coding making for a different genotype/possible phenotype. so blacks should take claim to an ERROR in coding?

i'm out.

WOW....how about you try again because you are KILLING ME really you are ...for the record please try to actually READ the things you post (please dont just google) ...she didn't have 8 limbs for just genetic reasons so get it straight and stop twisting things and now please allow me to help increase your biological knowledge base.

Lakshmi was born joined at the pelvis to a "parasitic twin" that stopped developing in her mother's womb.

Again another biology lesson for you, twinning is not a genetic error OR MUTATION ....this was a case of incomplete twinning where the egg did not split properly which is not determined by pure genetics......

Scientists believe conjoined twins form because of a delay in the fertilized egg's division. In normal identical twins, the egg splits at four to eight days after fertilization. In conjoined twins, however, the split occurs sometime after day 13. Instead of forming two separate embryos, the twins remain partially attached as they develop inside the womb. In most cases, conjoined twins do not survive more than a few days past birth because of a high rate of malformed organs and other severe birth abnormalities. However, surgical separations have been successful in conjoined twins that have a superficial physical connection.

Read more: http://www.healthline.com/galecontent/conjoined-twins#ixzz1IKcg42jC
Healthline.com - Connect to Better Health
​

oh and this one....

Genetic profile

Scientists are still searching for the cause of conjoined twins. They believe a combination of genetic and environmental factors may be responsible for this rare condition.

Read more: http://www.healthline.com/galecontent/conjoined-twins/2#ixzz1IKdWCxsP
Healthline.com - Connect to Better Health
​

So this statement: "for something to mutate means that it was not there before, there was an ERROR in the original coding making for a different genotype/possible phenotype. so blacks should take claim to an ERROR in coding? " is completely incorrect.

IF ITS NOT IN THE ORIGINAL DNA CODE IT WONT EXIST. THERE ARE NO "ERRORS". JUST VARIATIONS (I dont like calling people not like me mutants)....OTHERWISE WE WOULD ALL LOOK, ACT, THINK THE SAME which is NOT good for long term evolution and survival---BASIC BIOLOGY 101. (please read more about sexual reproduction, meiosis, and chromosomal variation to understand why this is)

Fortunately for us.... blonde straight hair and blue and green and grey eyes ARE!!!!! SOOO yes BLACK PEOPLE MADE THIS as OWNERS OF ORIGINAL DNA!!!!!! <<<<-------by not admitting this to yourself it would seem that there is possibly some shreads of "self hatred and denial" there too??!!! or is that reaching?? *kanye shrug*

Variation is what helps natural selection and helps adaptation for ALL humankind to survive....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vO2qqt_4lY

If you have never seen pure blooded Africans with blonde hair......please open your mind and embrace your African roots and knowledge by understanding we are some of the closest descendants fathers and mothers of all mankind.

" you will find that only the dark people of earth have the gene pool to produce every characteristic seen in humans on earth. The pale can not create the very dark, but the dark can create every shade. This is because the dark people of earth are the original humans of earth. .." comments by a you tube user...BUMP FOR TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!

 

[pocketbookgal]

Thank you! One of the basic rules of Debating: if you have to stoop to extremes to try and prove your point, then sit down and let your team mate do the job.

I am assuming you know absolutely nothing about ingredients in these vaccines to understand why it was compared to the "caustic chemicals" in relaxers. In case you missed my post from before here is a list.

• Aluminum Hydroxide (a cousin to Calcium and Sodium Hydroxide which are some of the "scary" relaxer ingredients) ,
• Aborted Fetal cells (often taken without the woman's direct consent)
• Ammonia and many other compounds containing it (also in texturizers as Ammonium bisulfite and ammonium thioglycolate (often considered less caustic than relaxer chemicals due to its lowered pH balance),
• Monkey Kidney tissue,
• Formaldehyde, (used to embalm dead bodies highly toxic)
• Thimerosol (Mercury--causes birth defects and brain disorders--very difficult to process in the body),
• phenol -a compound obtained by distillation of coal tar (also found in cigarettes)
• Calf serum protein,
• Sorbitol (a manufactured sugar alcohol) ---http://www.buzzle.com/articles/sorbitol-dangers.html
• Monkey fetal lung cells,
• MSG...the list goes on and on

http://www.vaclib.org/links/a.htm#aborted

http://www.informedchoice.info/cocktail.html

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/B/excipient-table-2.pdf


..... the difference is that you are injecting these things MULTIPLE TIMES INTO YOUR NEWBORN until they are adults!

So autism debate notwithstanding....these things are not good for the body.....or society....

http://www.thinktwice.com/birthcon.htm

You have no idea....none....

 

[BraunSugar]

Alright, so basically I'm not for relaxing little girls hair. When I say little girls, I mean like 3-11. Little girls normally wear pigtails, braids, twists, etc... styles I can do easily without heat or a relaxer. Some mothers do it because they don't know what else to do. Some do it because they just want their daughters to have a relaxer. Nothing wrong with it if that's what they want to do. I'm not a mother so I'm speaking on a theoretical situation here.

When my daughter was old enough to do it herself, I'd allow her to if that is what she wanted to do. I'd give her some precautions & share my experience with her, same as I would if she chose to straighten with heat, but I'd allow her to make the decision for herself as a teen.